Author Topic: Feat: Pugilist  (Read 4186 times)

Mystify

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Feat: Pugilist
« on: June 07, 2012, 09:40:16 AM »
Maybe you want a barbarian that punches things. Maybe you are making a English Gentleman who engages in fisticuffs. Maybe you are a boxer. Either  way, you might want to have a character who punches things without being a monk. In such a case,  you should be able to take

Pugilist[Combat]
You have trained in the art of using your fists as weapons
Benefit: When not wielding another weapon other than your unarmed strikes, your unarmed strikes have 3 weapon properties that would be available to Discipline of the Serpent. These properties do not stack with those granted by Disipline of the Serpant.  Your unarmed strikes have a +2 feat bonus to attacks and damage.


This can also be refluffed to having a natural weapon.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2012, 04:50:19 PM by Mystify »
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grayswx

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Re: Feat: Pugilist
« Reply #1 on: June 07, 2012, 11:23:32 AM »
The +2 seems rather strong for first level. Maybe it should scale (+1 at 3rd, +2 at 6th?).

Also, I feel like mechanics-wise it would fit better as an item bonus instead of a feat bonus, so it'll stack with feat bonuses that are meant to combine with weapons normally.

Mystify

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Re: Feat: Pugilist
« Reply #2 on: June 07, 2012, 11:27:39 AM »
The +2 seems rather strong for first level. Maybe it should scale (+1 at 3rd, +2 at 6th?).

Also, I feel like mechanics-wise it would fit better as an item bonus instead of a feat bonus, so it'll stack with feat bonuses that are meant to combine with weapons normally.
Cataphract is +2 and its takeable at 1st.
I don't want to make it an item bonus because then you can't properly benefit from enchanted fists. This should be considered roughly analogous to cataphract, only instead of being for people who use mounts, its for people who use fists(and are not monks).
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grayswx

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Re: Feat: Pugilist
« Reply #3 on: June 07, 2012, 11:56:59 AM »
Hm, I think I've never actually looked at cataphract.

...

Alright, its still a bit stronger than cataphract:
Cataphract only gives the attack bonus and not the damage bonus.
Cataphract is only useable while mounted (a weak difference, but still there).
Cataphract requires a trained skill.
Natural weapons are inherently better than normal ones. They can't be disarmed, dropped, etc., and they effectively have a super-quick-draw (You can drop any weapon as a free action).

So, it still seems a tad bit strong for 1st level if we use cataphract as a base.

Mystify

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Re: Feat: Pugilist
« Reply #4 on: June 07, 2012, 11:58:31 AM »
Hm, I think I've never actually looked at cataphract.

...

Alright, its still a bit stronger than cataphract:
Cataphract only gives the attack bonus and not the damage bonus.
Cataphract is only useable while mounted (a weak difference, but still there).
Cataphract requires a trained skill.
Natural weapons are inherently better than normal ones. They can't be disarmed, dropped, etc., and they effectively have a super-quick-draw (You can drop any weapon as a free action).

So, it still seems a tad bit strong for 1st level if we use cataphract as a base.
Keep in mind cataphract is getting a boost. And this feat is only useable with your unarmed strikes.
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gkathellar

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Re: Feat: Pugilist
« Reply #5 on: June 07, 2012, 03:54:48 PM »
Replace all instances of "monk" with "Discipline of the Serpent."
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Mystify

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Re: Feat: Pugilist
« Reply #6 on: June 07, 2012, 04:50:30 PM »
Replace all instances of "monk" with "Discipline of the Serpent."
Alright ,done.
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Kalik

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Re: Feat: Pugilist
« Reply #7 on: June 08, 2012, 12:43:45 AM »
I like it. It's a feat for a permanent, better weapon.

Exelixi

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Re: Feat: Pugilist
« Reply #8 on: June 13, 2012, 10:38:57 AM »
I really like this. It's like the Knuckleduster, but more flexible! I do agree that it should be a scaling bonus, though.
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Mystify

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Re: Feat: Pugilist
« Reply #9 on: June 13, 2012, 12:36:06 PM »
I really like this. It's like the Knuckleduster, but more flexible! I do agree that it should be a scaling bonus, though.
Why?  Similar feats aren't scaling.
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Exelixi

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Re: Feat: Pugilist
« Reply #10 on: June 13, 2012, 12:43:41 PM »
+2 to attack and damage at first level is a bit high- and presumably all of your non-ranged attacks would get the bonus, because there would be no reason not to use your fists when they're strictly better.

For later levels, can you enchant your fists? If not, then there should be a continually-increasing bonus that allows you to keep up with magic weapons.

In addition, the [Reach] and [Thrown] properties should be off-limits. (As I understand it, [Barbed] is being either rewritten or discarded, so no comment there.)
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Mystify

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Re: Feat: Pugilist
« Reply #11 on: June 13, 2012, 12:56:04 PM »
+2 to attack and damage at first level is a bit high- and presumably all of your non-ranged attacks would get the bonus, because there would be no reason not to use your fists when they're strictly better.

For later levels, can you enchant your fists? If not, then there should be a continually-increasing bonus that allows you to keep up with magic weapons.

In addition, the [Reach] and [Thrown] properties should be off-limits. (As I understand it, [Barbed] is being either rewritten or discarded, so no comment there.)
You could do it anyways with cataphract. And yes, all of your melee attacks would probably be unarmed strikes. Thats the point, you are punching things.
Natural attacks, unarmed included, can be enchanted with the point buy.
Why do you think it needs additional restrictions from monk? I can only see fluff reasons to not put those on a pugilist, and the feat should not be restricting fluff.Maybe my fluff is that I AM a monk, I just don't use combat maneuvers ,and instead like to throw hadoukens around. If you don't like the fluff for  particular option, don't take that option. It is not the job of the ability designer to dictate what fluff  is inappropriate.
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Exelixi

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Re: Feat: Pugilist
« Reply #12 on: June 13, 2012, 01:00:03 PM »
Ah, I see. That works, then. (Mind you, it is a bit better, since there are plenty of situations where you don't have your horse/gryphon/motorcycle/steampunk motorcycle horse, but none where you don't have your fists)
« Last Edit: June 13, 2012, 01:03:43 PM by Exelixi »
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Mystify

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Re: Feat: Pugilist
« Reply #13 on: June 13, 2012, 01:03:57 PM »
Ah, I see. That works, then. (Mind you, it is a bit better, since there are plenty of situations where you don't have your horse/gryphon/motorcycle/steampunk motorcycle horse, but none where you don't have your fists)

DotS can't have [Reach].
Then neither can this. I have the "would be available to Discipline of the Serpent" clause for a reason. That is a place where they have decided what properties would or would not be suitable for unarmed strikes, and by attaching to it, it automatically stays up to date on whatever changes they make.
And its really easy to have some kind of mount. "I get on my mundane skateboard",and bam, you are mounted.
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Re: Feat: Pugilist
« Reply #14 on: June 13, 2012, 01:06:19 PM »
Ah, alright.

Skateboard? Not all campaigns are set in a time where skateboards exist. (Although a lancer riding a skateboard in full plate would be very amusing)

Just saying, there are situations.
http://www.ruleofcool.com/smf/index.php/topic,1185.0.html - A point-buy chassis (class) system. Perfectly balanced by the judicious application of SCIENCE!

""Release your inner dwarf.  Then get him some ale!" -EspyLacopa
"I have no idea what Exelixi looks like. I just picture crow feathers and a claymore." -Fro