Author Topic: New system using Legend's mechanics?  (Read 3853 times)

Iceberg256

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New system using Legend's mechanics?
« on: August 21, 2015, 03:20:09 PM »
What I'm curious about is, using the OGL, would it possible for someone to take the all the mechanical rules of Legend and create their own system with them?  Would there be some legal product identity issues that would prevent such a thing?  I'm only really asking for the sake of a thought exercise, as I'm certainly not volunteering for such a project.  I hardly have time to play games, let alone develop one.

For the sake of further discussion, if you were to develop your own Legend based fantasy heartbreaker system, what elements would you keep?  What would you eliminate or change?

Personally, I would certainly retain the tracks and tiers.  Without them I don't feel there would be any reason to repurpose this material.  Therefore I would retain a level-based character development, especially considering I feel Legend was one of the few systems that handled levelling mechanics well outside of class abilities.  I also really love the customizable equipment and magic items, so I would endeavor to retain those systems.

I would like to do away with races and classes.  The species of a character would largely be flavor and role playing based, with specific tracks or feats handling explicitly non-human capabilities.  Classes largely feel like an artificial restriction on track selection that's pretty easy to mostly work around within the rules as it is.  I would do away with Ability Scores. I would keep the modifiers in one form or another, although perhaps the specific abilities and their number could be different.  I would like to considerably pear down and simplify conditions in the game.  I would also consider changing the base die mechanic, perhaps to 2d6.  Not a huge fan of d20, as I prefer a bell curve and feel the wide range of 1d20 to be wildly random.

Kitsune Inari

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Re: New system using Legend's mechanics?
« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2016, 08:45:28 AM »
Not entirely unrelated, I think what Legend does could also be adapted to the D&D framework. Reworking the tracks to fit with Bounded Accuracy, basing AC off Proficiency, reworking the Race building rules, things like that. It could be awesome.

Iceberg256

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Re: New system using Legend's mechanics?
« Reply #2 on: February 04, 2016, 02:38:21 PM »
I could certainly see that.  One of my biggest gripes with 5e is that it doesn't allow much customization with some classes.  If race, class, and background each provided benefits across all levels like Legend's tracks (or like Basic, Expert, and Master paths of "Shadow of the Demon Lord"), then 5e would probably be fairly more palpable to me.

Mystify

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Re: New system using Legend's mechanics?
« Reply #3 on: April 08, 2016, 02:31:04 PM »
Tracks are definitely a keeper. races and classes are chaff. It needs more support for out of combat abilities. Avoiding locking attributes to specific combat abilities is good.

Bell curves sound nice, but don't work so hot in practice. It amplifies every difference. It makes rolls tend towards the mean, so someone who has a little bit more AC than normal ends up pushing a lot of the rolls to misses, and similarly someone slightly more accurate hits a ton more. The allowable variance in what can be rolled and still remain balanced plummets.

I'll just say this isn't entirely hypothetical
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rejectedreality

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Re: New system using Legend's mechanics?
« Reply #4 on: April 08, 2016, 03:22:00 PM »
I'll just say this isn't entirely hypothetical

Oh man, if this means what I think it means. Well. Anticipation mounts.

To contribute a little more, I've tossed around the idea of "out of combat" tracks, and "in combat tracks". In Legend, I kinda imagine that you'd get your main 3 tracks for combat, and an additional track for your out of combat role. Tracks like "Negotiator" that provides bonuses and new capabilities for diplomacy, and "loreseeker" that provides automatic successes for knowledges, or application of those knowledges to other seekers.

Never put much thought into actually developing the idea, though.
« Last Edit: April 08, 2016, 03:28:35 PM by rejectedreality »

Desocupado

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Re: New system using Legend's mechanics?
« Reply #5 on: April 08, 2016, 06:48:53 PM »
Earthdawn has some pretty interesting ideas to round up the attribute system (and social skills).

There are also 6 stats - 3 physical and 3 mental
Strength, Dexterity and toughness
Perception, Willpower and Charisma
Quote
Strength (S) is used for tests involving forcing, breaking, or moving things.
Toughness (T) indicates resistance to disease, poison, and damage.
Dexterity (D) is the base for almost all other physical tests,
Perception (P) is for noticing and remembering things, and usually for breaking illusions.
Willpower (W) is for breaking charms, compulsions, and enchantments, and forcing the world to do as you please.
Charisma (C) controls your ability to affect other people through social interaction, and your resistance to manipulation.
Personally I always disliked D&D's wisdom and intelligence as a player status and having charisma based divine favour.


I think [legendary] tiers, equipment and track choice is the best part of the customization. (and more than enough for a compute game)

Substituting skills for a "skill track" seem reasonable.

About 2d6 - it would go GURPS 3d6 - but this would require a heavy rework/reduction on dice bonuses - akin to what 5th edition did

Iceberg256

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Re: New system using Legend's mechanics?
« Reply #6 on: April 12, 2016, 12:26:27 PM »
Tracks are definitely a keeper. races and classes are chaff. It needs more support for out of combat abilities. Avoiding locking attributes to specific combat abilities is good.

Bell curves sound nice, but don't work so hot in practice. It amplifies every difference. It makes rolls tend towards the mean, so someone who has a little bit more AC than normal ends up pushing a lot of the rolls to misses, and similarly someone slightly more accurate hits a ton more. The allowable variance in what can be rolled and still remain balanced plummets.

I'll just say this isn't entirely hypothetical

Definitely some good points there.  Having 2d6 or a similar die mechanic would certainly require an extremely tight control and a limited range of modifiers and target numbers, so yeah, it would make sense to stick with a flat probability for a system like Legend.

If you were to develop something new using ideas from Legend, I'd certainly be interested in seeing what comes of it.

Draz

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Re: New system using Legend's mechanics?
« Reply #7 on: May 03, 2016, 05:04:28 PM »
Bell curves sound nice, but don't work so hot in practice. It amplifies every difference. It makes rolls tend towards the mean, so someone who has a little bit more AC than normal ends up pushing a lot of the rolls to misses, and similarly someone slightly more accurate hits a ton more. The allowable variance in what can be rolled and still remain balanced plummets.

Well, doesn't this depend entirely on what kind of bell curve we're talking about? 3d6 or even 2d10 is a pretty sharply-peaked bell curve, but something like "roll 3d20, take the middle result" is much gentler, while still tending towards the average.

Mystify

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Re: New system using Legend's mechanics?
« Reply #8 on: May 03, 2016, 05:37:44 PM »
Somewhat. It still serves to emphasize the advantage, and hence tends to give escalating returns to investing in things which modify rolls.

Bell curves can be nice for skills, where a lower variance makes more sense, esp. If gradiated success are in use. But in combat, it really just comes down to success chances, so the fact your distribution of values is a bell curve don't matter  so much as you having a 25% chance to suceeds on the roll. So, it's main value would be in how it affects the probabilities as you vary bonuses.
However, a bell curve is harder to predict. You don't know if they started with a 50% chance or a 25% chance, and the benefit received will vary based on which case. It skews it even more in favor of better stats.
The shallower you make the bell curve, thr les impact this has, but correspondingly the less the curve matters.  Wby use a curve at all if you are trying to minimize it's impact?
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hewhohuntscats

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Re: New system using Legend's mechanics?
« Reply #9 on: July 01, 2016, 10:50:41 PM »
So this is going in it's own thread too, but it's worth mentioning here.

I'm running an alpha playtest for a legend-inspired spritual successor. Here's the thread link: http://www.ruleofcool.com/smf/index.php/topic,1498.0.html